A response from Saddleback and my reply (regarding the Daniel Plan)

(Scroll down to see my original email to Saddleback and the response from David Chrzan, Chief of Staff at Saddleback)

-------- Original Message --------

Subject:	Re: Truly puzzled
Date:	Sat, 12 Feb 2011 07:04:07 +0800
From:	Ron Oommen
To:	Rick Warren’s Office

Dear David

Thank you for taking the time to respond. I appreciate that.

I have been following the ongoing lectures, etc on the Saddleback website and have also visited the blog link you included in your reply.

I have to say, my initial concerns remain unaddressed. My original question about what exactly three non-believers would be feeding the people of Saddleback appears to be answered. From the videos, etc on your website I have watched the good doctors plug to Saddleback exactly what they have to the rest of the world. In the midst of the  medical jargon, I also listened to them plug yoga and similar types of meditation as highly beneficial. As a believer in Christ, you should know that there is no such thing as "Christian" yoga. Ask a Hindu and see what he/she would say - yoga is unequivocally Hindu in concept, essence and practice. What Saddleback appears to have done is legitimise such practices as part of the Christian walk through your promotion of the three doctors and their worldviews and philosophies - with nary a word or caution about testing everything against God's Word. Do you not realise that unbiblical teaching always comes with subtlety and not openly? Read the Bible and see how many times we are warned against false teachers and prophets 'creeping in' among us, or as 'wolves in sheep's clothing'.

The blog kept referring to the need to have a conversation with the culture, and that this is what the Daniel Plan is doing, especially since there are lots of unbelievers coming to the sessions who will very likely remain to be in church. Like Paul, I can commend this if Christ is being preached by whatever means. However, is Christ indeed being preached? What exactly is the point of unbelievers continuing to come to church if they do not repent of their sins and become born again? I fear that Saddleback is falling into the trap of 'enticing' people under false pretences, attracting them to come to church, and not telling them it means nothing at all unless they 'die to themselves' and become new creations in Christ. Have they repented of their sins? Or do they simply pray a 'sinner's prayer' and have a pastor/leader proclaim them 'saved'? Please look to the Word and examine your own programs and beliefs.

Since I'm nobody to you, you're under no obligation to listen to me or even pay any heed to my words. However, biblically, I see no precedent for your premise that we need to have a 'conversation with the culture' in order to save people from hell. I think you've put the cart before the horse. Redeeming people is what Jesus  shed His blood for. If people are being approached with anything less than the gospel, namely that we are all in sin and under penalty of death, that Jesus the Christ - the Word of God and God Himself - came and died upon a cross, and rose on the third day that we might repent and have remission of our sins, then we are not giving them the good news but 'another gospel', as noted in Paul's letter to the Galatians and you can read for yourself what the Word of God has to say about that. Anything less than this is manipulation. It would be akin to a timeshare shyster trying to sign you up on the basis of pictures of palm islands and pretty beaches and not telling you what it will cost and how long you will need to pay for it.

I encourage you all at Saddleback to give up your compromise of God's Word, start to study it for yourselves, and ask God for understanding to walk in His ways without compromise. The Bible repeatedly warns us to examine ourselves to see if we are indeed in the faith. Do not commend yourselves that your programs are drawing many to church, or that you have thousands of members, or that your pastor dines with presidents and kings. Jesus said that at the end, many will come to him telling Him of how much they've done for the kingdom and He will reject them, saying "I never knew you. Depart from me, workers of iniquity". Read the scripture for yourself (Matt 7:22) and tell me how you can even attempt to ignore that?

I fear, though, that Saddleback loves the things and adulation of the world too much to pay attention to this. Beware, our Lord is returning and will not tarry a single hour beyond the time fixed by the Father. Make sure that you are indeed doing His will - and not yours or the culture's or anyone else's. Remember that the Bible tells us that friendship with this world is enmity to God. You can rationalise that all you like but you cannot pretend that the Bible teaches otherwise. Do not love the world that you feel the need to 'redeem the culture'.  God loved the world so much that He gave His only Son that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life (John 3:16). No mention of redeeming the culture, is there? The gospel is always good news to people. God loves people, period. When people, repent and become new creatures in Christ, their patterns, habits, practices change - they HAVE to, if they are truly Christ's. This is the only way cultures can be 'redeemed', if such a thing is possible. Anything else is superficial and dishonest because it does not present the true Gospel.

I pray for you all that God will open your eyes and enable you to judge rightly. Really, I do. It pains me no end that this shallow excuse for the gospel that appears to be endemic throughout the American church is now being fed to other parts of the world, particularly to the simple folk of Africa and Asia. Do you recall Jesus' rebuke of the Pharisees that they would travel the seas to win one convert and then end up making him twice a son of hell than they were (Matt 23:15)? Beware lest you find yourselves under like rebuke.

Disregard me, if you like. I am truly nobody. I do not feast with kings or schmooze with those in high places. Regard the Word of God, though - there is no excuse for not doing that. And remember that those who teach the Word will be judged more severely - if you are found peddling anything less than the gospel, beware lest judgement come upon you.

I pray for you all. May God have mercy on you.

Yours sincerely,
Ron Oommen

On 12/02/2011 3:02 AM, Rick Warren’s Office wrote:

Dear Ron,

Thanks for taking the time to write to Pastor Rick about The Daniel Plan.  As a result of the program’s wide popularity we’re not able to answer individual questions instead we’re asking people to visit our blog and read an article that answers frequently asked questions and explains the plan’s evolution.

All of The Daniel Plan lectures, articles, recipes and health tips are available online at our website.

God Bless,

David Chrzan

Chief of Staff

-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Oommen [mailto:roney.oommen@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, January 14, 2011 5:48 AM
To: Communications
Subject: Truly puzzled

Dear Rev Warren and the church at Saddlesback

I happened to visit the Saddleback website today and was surprised to

find that Saddleback is promoting the "Daniel Plan" for health. No, I

wasn't surprised by that. What astounded me was the panel that you have

assembled to do this - three well-known and prominent health

professionals in Americaand the world at large who are, as far as I am

aware, not only not believers in Jesus Christ but active proponents of

non-Christian and pagan philosophies as a basis for their health

initiatives.

Since there is no indication that these men have now become followers of

Christ, do you really expect that they will put their pagan worldviews

aside for the Daniel Plan? Or is it more reasonable to expect that they

will give the people of Saddleback exactly what they give to the rest of

America and the world - Reiki, eastern meditation and the like?

I'm not sure whether one should be shocked or saddened that either : 1)

You and the members of Saddleback do not appear to be able to see why

this is so strange and unnatural, or 2) You already know this, but you

simply don't care, for reasons of your own.

I am a believer from a Third World African country. I cannot begin to

understand how you Americans think that engaging in eastern occultic

(yes, that is what Reiki and tantric meditation are) practices -

ostensibly for health reasons - can at all be reconciled to those who

are the temple of the Holy Spirit of the Living God.

Far be it from me to judge your intentions or motives. However, the

fruit that you are showing is very, very bad. I shudder to think of how

many immature and young believers will be caused to stumble because of

this and engage in things that will harm their souls and spirits.

May God have mercy on you.

In all humility I am,

Sincerely yours,

R. Oommen

Critical Issues Commentary: Richard Foster—Celebration of Deception

Critical Issues Commentary: Richard Foster—Celebration of Deception

It really boggles the mind how people can read stuff written by people like Richard Foster or Dallas Willard and not be alarmed at how far from the Word these men are. Why? Why do people WANT to believe a lie??
Perhaps 2 Thessalonians 2: 11 & 12 provide an explanation.

Stop and Think....Please

http://www.biblical-pentecostals.org/slain.htm

What does the Bible really say about 'territorial spirits'?

I don't remember when exactly it was that I was first introduced to the teaching that there are territorial spirits that exist in every human habitation, whether villages, towns or cities which have to 'warred against' spiritually and be bound and defeated in order to allow the gospel to be preached effectively and for souls to be saved. I suspect it may have had something to do with books I read by someone in YWAM (not sure if it was Floyd McClung) and also by Neil Anderson as well as the book 'He Came to Set the Captives Free' by that truly kooky character, Dr Rebecca Brown. It may also have been listening to the testimony of someone like Mike Warnke, the former 'high priest of Satan', and similar stories. It may have been the subsequent teaching of men of God I respected greatly which informed me of these things.

And, yet, all the while in the inmost depths of my spirit, there was a disquiet - because I could find none of these teachings laid out in Scripture. Of course, you had all the various verses that are quoted by teachers of this ilk to support this theory but I am talking about a consistent and emphatic witness in Scripture of such things, like the good news of the kingdom of God, the coming, death and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ, etc. Did Scripture teach such a 'doctrine' or did men dream this up and go looking for Scripture verses to tack onto their teachings?

So, to the Word I finally went - as I should I have from the outset. (*sound of self booing self*).

This is just a simple blog so I will not go into a detailed refutation here but, suffice to say, I find it next to impossible to see ANYWHERE in Scripture that we are told to fight against territorial spirits to make the way easier for people to accept the Lord - it's simply not in Scripture. Sure, the Bible clearly talks about Satan who is the 'prince of the power of the air' and of principalities and spiritual wickedness in the high places and that we have to put on the full armour of God to stand (Eph 6). But, don't take my word for it. Do this for yourself. Start in the New Testament and find out how many times Jesus 'warred' against teritorial spirits and taught his disciples to do the same. Read about all the times that the apostles, including Paul whose missionary journeys are clearly documented for us, taught and practised this doctrine. See how many times we are exhorted to be fighting against territorial spirits and bringing down the strongholds over cities, etc, to free up the effective preaching of the gospel.

That's right - none. Nada. Zilch. Not one single instance can be found. Now, would you agree with me that such a key doctrine, if true, would have been prominently taught in the New Testament? So, perhaps, it's not so key after all! Perhaps, it's not even a true teaching.

I mean, think about it. How many times have you heard someone pray, or even prayed yourself (I've done both in the past) for Satan to be bound? With so many praying in this manner, ya gotta wonder - WHO'S THE JOKER SETTING HIM LOOSE AGAIN???

What DO we see in the New Testament? When the apostles were taken before the Council and ordered not to speak about Jesus (Acts 4), they went back and started to 'come against the evil spirit over Jerusalem' and bind the strong man.....yeah, right. None of that nonsense! They gathered and prayed to the Lord - who is sovereign over any principality or power - and asked Him for boldness to continue declaring His Word!

And so on and so forth. Show me one instance of any of the New Testament believers doing this 'fighting against teritorial spirits' thing?

It's simply not in the Bible. And, if it's not in the Bible it must be.....false.

Elementary, my dear Watson.

PS. Perhaps, I should add that Mike Warnke's testimony, on which so much teaching about Satanism was based, turned out to be one huge lie - even though he continues to maintain its truth to this day without being able to put forward any evidence to support any of the 'facts' in his book. Rebecca Brown turns out to be one paranoid, delusional individual, stripped of her licence to practise medicine. Hmm, and these are the teachers we're following?? Now wonder the church is so confused.

DOES WHAT YOU BELIEVE REALLY MATTER?

A very timely message from Pastor Ken Silva.

DOES WHAT YOU BELIEVE REALLY MATTER?

Paul Proctor - Today’s ‘Christianity’ – Nothing More Than Feelings - Part 2

Paul Proctor - Today’s ‘Christianity’ – Nothing More Than Feelings

Testing all things...

http://herescope.blogspot.com/2011/02/its-that-simple.html